http://www.maniaman.com/zappasez.htm
Right on, Mr. Moss!!
FYI y\'all - today, Monday 10/18 is the deadline for registration here in California - run yourself on out and do it or do it online - but do it today!
One of your neighbours to the north, namely ME ;), would like to wish all my USAmerican cousins a successful election this time around. We\'re all watching to see what happens, hoping for a good turnout and a clear decision.
From an outsider\'s POV, it\'s really hard to tell what the outcome will be. I suspect the insiders find it hard too. It sounds like an awfully close thing. And I honestly don\'t know what to hope for either.
I believe that W is the first letter of "Wrong Choice" for both the USA and the world, but it probably also could stand as the first letter of "Who the f*** do you think you are criticizing another country\'s choices?" in the eyes of some.
Some folks up here think that K will be the first letter of "Keep up the protection of US business by Keeping out foreign (i.e. Canadian) softwood lumber, beef, &c". To me it seems logical that trade globalization can\'t be stopped forever by legislation in any country. Not saying whether that\'s good or bad, as far as I can see it\'s going to happen regardless.
I don\'t know. All I can personally do is wish you folks good luck on Election Day! May you get a government that listens more to its citizens than to special interest groups. (We could use some of that here, too.)
oh yeah...please vote?! ;D
i for one thank you for your well wishes - and your hope that we do get a new regime.
i believe that the world is getting smaller, tighter, more closely knit - and that in order for us all to live in harmony on this rock we need to learn to share. we need to accept that competition is how we keep economies active, and healthy. while i think that the outsourcing tax benefits the major corporations have gained are wrong, i do think that we have some responsibility to help other countries provide wages and benefits to their people in such a way that they no longer resent what we have here.
it wouldn\'t hurt us to stop shoving our chain stores, burger joints and amusement parks in their faces, however. what we\'ve done to the health of people around the world is horrifying; what we\'ve done to native cultures and customs is even more insidious.
???I was a real dilbert to reregister... ah well...shoot the moon, becuase the sun don\'t want any...
Chris
GOOD LUCK, USA!!!
I hope you have a record-breaking turnout & a clear decision...oh yes, the appropriate winner would be nice too... ;)
btw, did you see the home page over at http://www.percevalpress.com? Wow, great stuff, and kudos to VM & Co. for taking a stand and speaking so eloquently.
Thank You, we\'ll need it! The Presidential selection of 2000 and it\'s historic glitch and subsequent outcome has caused many voters concern for this election.
Already there have been two Federal Lawsuits filed prior to the polling of Nov. 2nd (*Link* http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=613327§ion=news )
and there are threats of other suits after the election. (* Link*: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04307/405349.stm )
I long for the good old days when one attended their polling place, cast their vote and went home to await the broadcast of the clear cut winner.
However, the inception of this Administrations selection into office; making history as only the second occurrence of election error in our voting history and also as a first in that GW is the first President selected by the Supreme Court to sit the seat, our election process is now at odds with itself and the constituency via/ voter intimidation, fraud, etc....
It\'s a sad state of affairs and yet with this President and his vision of his AmeriKa, it\'s almost as if that focus and energy is expanding into the over all democratic process .
GW\'s Presidential platform has proven that absolute power corrupts absolutely. And sadly it would appear it also infects the process that would allow the people in the grip of that power to determine if they wish the strangle hold to continue.
Goddess Bless America and save us from the Bush.
(http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/MessagexGifs/Butterfly1.gif)(http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/SIGNATURE_ART/VOTE.gif)
yes, please, for the sake of the country and our democratic process, regardless of your choice - please run out and exercise your right to vote. if you\'ve already done it, then good on ya!
[size=32][glb]VOTE - millions of lives depend on it![/glb][/size]
Piece by Bob Herbert of the New York Times. A fabulous and highly under-rated columnist.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/01/opinion/01herbert.html?th
Monday, November 1, 2004 letter from Michael Moore, with great explanation of why Nader is not the choice to make this time.
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1101-30.htm
and for those who come to this site because of a certain well spoken Danish-American:
http://www.percevalpress.com/home.html
Sing along with me; "It\'s the end of the world as we know it...." (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/BowedSaddy.gif)
For the first time in four years, GW was elected into office for a second term. And the GOP gained majority in both the House and the Senate. ( Article *Link*: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6363692/?GT1=5809 )
I voted for Kerry after all and almost straight Democrat, save for the 3 Independent candidates on the ballot. What a horrific morning to witness a dire future for all Americans.
With 4 Supreme Court justices slated to retire this year, Bush is said to plan in nominating 4 conservative, anti~choice, candidates to the bench.
If that happens, Roe V. Wade faces a possible over turn. Which means womens rights will take two steps back.
Goddess save America!
[size=10]*article link edit*[/size]
Ocean, you did the right thing, as many others did - but it just wasn\'t enough. They got out their "Morality" banner and pulled all the hyper-conservative anti-intellectual stops out.
11 states voted to ban gay marriage when that wasn\'t even really a possibility in the first place - but by putting that on the ballots in those states they played the piper\'s trill to millions of little rats who harbor bigotry deep in their hearts under the guise of morality. They were very quiet on the abortion issue, knowing that if they could just maintain power long enough they would be able to do as you say, create a nearly full conservative Supreme Court. Our world is now their oyster.
Women, Immigrants, Gays & Lesbians, Dissenters - we are all screwed now, no dinner, no flowers, no KY. Just the overwhelming fist of "Biblical Justice."
Oh thank you for that upbeat optimism for my future! (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/DeadMan.gif) It\'s certainly added it\'s bit to my depressed and whining morning, as I continue to watch Fox news, MSNBC and CNN, for the closing poll tallies.
Now I await Kerry\'s concession speech to begin and right after that GW will boast another 4 years of control and fundamentalist tyranny, for America!
(http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/pride2.gif) What the voters in those 11 States fail to realize is that they voted to suppress equality for a segment of American community and that fundamentalist extremism is always a threat to a civilized and free society. It\'s not just terror from the Middle East that American\'s have to fear now. It\'s terrorism in the name of one man\'s vision of his AmeriKa, which does not include equality for all Americans or freedom from a totalitarian vision.
God\'s what can we do!? I pray it inspires those who have been complacent on the political front, to get active and pay attention to their local legislature and the National agenda. Write letters, telephone, join activist groups, especially women who care about preserving their right to protect and choose, their own reproductive future. Speak up and speak out, for freedom is never free.
Goddess Bless America and save us.... now! Right frickin now, damn it! Aaaaaaargh! (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/hammer.gif)
I\'m Okaaaaay! (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/Box_O_Smilie.gif)
my parents are moving to Mexico. they want us to go too, and to talk our boys into going too - since they\'re draft age. one of them has a pregnant girlfriend. we can\'t just leave our lives and run. or can we?
sorry to be a downer, Ocean honey, but Pollyanna i ain\'t and never have been. i want to run, but i want to stay and fight. i want to quit my job and do all the painting and writing i can, crossing the country trying to bring enlightenment to the masses... but more likely i\'ll just get my ass kicked in Wyoming, one more scarecrow left to drain on the fence.
i am a fighter. i have survived bipolar largely without meds because i won\'t let my depression kill me without a fight, so i think i can beat this. the thing is, it\'s a nation and it\'s values pitted against a nation full of spoonfed bible thumpers. they don\'t read the bible they thump, they just use it to thump to death anything they don\'t know or understand.
my father used to say "come the revolution." what more does it take to get that revolution off the couch and into the streets? how much more can we swallow, before we start to choke ourselves?
Four more years to shake my head and say, "Well, I didn\'t vote for him!" Grrr! >:(
Ah well--at least I voted. :-/
Hugs for everybody! ;D
Peace,
Bella )O(
Quotemy parents are moving to Mexico. they want us to go too, and to talk our boys into going too - since they\'re draft age. one of them has a pregnant girlfriend. we can\'t just leave our lives and run. or can we?
[size=111]
THERE\'S NOT GOING TO BE A DRAFT! SHUT UP ABOUT A DRAFT... WHERE DO YOU PEOPLE GET YOUR INFORMATION?! YOU LISTEN TO MICHAEL MOORE TOO GODDAMN MUCH.[/size]
hey, Machete! long time no see!
i don\'t listen to Michael Moore on this issue any more than you do - on this issue i listen to Bush. not the specific words about the draft, but the oil domination plans his energy policy outlines. i read what has been written by Bush\'s people and i see that there is no way they can do all the things they want to do without a draft. they don\'t have enough people already trapped by the backdoor draft they\'re running, so they are going to have to "regretfully" implement a draft.
read, Machete, read what they say they "need" to do to feed the petroleum hungry monster that is America. they refuse to move out of the fossil fuel age - because R&D takes money, and oil makes money. they wanna be on the cash end of the deal.
Felt so gutted as a Brit that KERRY lost the election.
It aint right that such an evil man, like Bush, can regain so much power all over again...
unless that is...it was already decided before the vote took place, esp with using machine ballotts & all.
Makes ya wonder aye!
GOD OR WHOEVER...HELP US ALL!!!!!!!! :\'(
ah, but you see, his version of God and Christianity is precisely what got us this result. they pandered to the people who confuse morality with evangelical doctrine.
remember Bush the Senior\'s "New World Order" - there\'s a very good reason it sounded familiar. Dubya has just carried out the master plan...
"The National Government will regard it as its first and foremost duty to revive in the nation the spirit of unity and cooperation. It will preserve and defend those basic principles on which our nation has been built. It regards Christianity as the foundation of our national morality, and the family as the basis of national life." Adolph Hitler, My New World Order, Proclamation to the German Nation at Berlin, February 1, 1933
gee, and i thought WWII was over. Dubya is fast at work uniting his AmeriKa to drive the rest of us out or underground.
hey, Ocean, you slipped in there while i was writing my response to m4sure - and with your eloquent and well supported remarks i feel sure i\'ve no reason to continue pulling up all these same little tags i had piled up here.
hehehehehe - two minds, eh? - [glb]ok - wow - weird - where\'d you go with that lovely reply????[/glb] ah, after mine now, is it? very sneaky! :-*
as for the personal attack - Machete has done that before, so i don\'t take it to heart. it\'s a well known fact that when someone has no true retort he just shouts [glb]"NUH-UNH"[/glb] as loud as he can in your face.
Dear Machete, [glb]"When you resort to attacking the messenger and not the message, you have lost the debate." Addison Whithecomb[/glb]
Source *Link* http://www.sss.gov/
On October 5, 2004, the House of Representatives voted 402 - 2 to defeat H.R. 163, the bill cited as proof that the Selective Service was preparing to reinstate a military draft. The vote made official what has been a reality since January 7, 2003, when H.R. 163 was introduced despite nearly total opposition in Congress to restoring the draft. Without Congressional support, the draft cannot be reinstated. A similar bill languishes in the Senate.
Both President George W. Bush and Senator John F. Kerry have stated for the record that they oppose a draft. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld also has opposed the draft on numerous occasions.
Since 1980, the Selective Service System has discharged its mission of preparing to manage a draft if and when Congress and the President so direct. The House action proves that the Selective Service has gotten no such direction. That being the case, the Agency will maintain its readiness as required by law, and to register young men between the ages of 18 and 25. That mission has been reaffirmed frequently by successive Administrations and by Congress under the leadership of both parties.
Article Link:
http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,FL_loss_092704,00.html
Excerpt September 27th, 2004 article:
(sic) "The Pentagon issued its latest stop-loss order in June, forcing thousands of men and women to stay in the military and requiring many to return to combat duty well beyond their agreed-upon period of active service. The effect of the order has been that thousands of members of the all-volunteer armed forces no longer are serving voluntarily. "
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
It\'s a fact that the Bush administration has been advised that our ground troops in Iraq are not enough to ensure the military exercise currently in place. Hence the inception of the military "stop loss order", on troops already deployed in the Iraqi theater.
With concerns arising about the instability of the leadership and intent of North Korea, and Iran, to name just a few, we obviously do not have enough military personnel to police the regions of concern that currently occupy the attention of the Pentagon.
The stop loss order is the first hurdle in trying to curb the difficulties inherent in low enlistment rolls and not having enough ground troops for deployment to hot zones.
The stop loss order is a bold violation of the U.S. Constitution in that it implements "Involuntary Servitude" , against reservists and enlisted volunteer\'s who have served their contract to military service, and yet are not released from duty.
This is an act of desperation via/ the Pentagon and is an example that our current military force is not enough, if it were to follow normal protocol regarding enlistee\'s and the end of their tour of duty.
Given that and the fact that this "war" will continue at least another 4 years, since GW was re~elected into office yesterday, the Pentagon must attend other options if the U.S. is to meet the call to service in Iraq and other regions of concerns per this Administration.
Selective Service is already in place and has been for years. The first article link provided in this post, proves that a draft is an option that has been considered and implemented to a certain degree. It takes but one act of congress to open the rolls and initiate the draft.
It is ignorance and naiveté to imagine there will never be a draft during the second term of this Administration.
Bush attacked Kerry during the campaign for waffling on the issues. However Bush, during the first campaign for office made promises and then, when selected into office, waffled on keeping them. (Example: "I\'m a uniter, not a divider". within the United States and the World. *just one example of his inconsistency*)
Given that, one can not trust Bush to keep his word about refusing to consider implementation of the draft during his Administration. . It is clearly a "wait and see" , rather than any guarantee, that a draft will not become law in the next 4 years.
My condolences to 49+% of my USAmerican cousins. I will never understand the kind of thinking that could endorse W\'s regime, if indeed there were thought processes involved and not just knee jerk emotional or religious triggers. No, I know it\'s really none of my business in the sense that I\'m a citizen of another country, but as a citizen of the world I am in mourning.
My country welcomed thousands of draft evaders in the late \'60s & early \'70s from our southern neighbour, and I suspect we may be called on to do so again. I hope we, or rather, our politicians have the courage to rise to the occasion, and don\'t knuckle under to Big Brother.
My deepest sympathies go out to those with family members & friends in military service, or with children who will soon be of draft age. I do not envy your situations or whatever decisions you may be faced with related to the warmongering policies of the administration over the next 4 years. Surely the politics of oil are not worthy of spending lives on?
:(
thank you, oldfolkie. i for one appreciate the position this puts the world community in. funny you should say mourning, that\'s what i put on my home page...
unfortunately, your government has already made a pact not to accept our people looking to avoid the draft. if they are going to make that move they need to do it before the draft is called and find a "legitimate" way to stay, or they will be returned to Uncle Sam.
sadly, it\'s not just politics, it\'s money - and that is a deadly combination for humanity.
:-[ Sorry about the reply switcheroo there gkg. I realized after posting that the font color code was off at the bottom of the post, so I deleted it, added a little extra tid bit of opinion, and reposted.
Great minds my Darlin, great minds! (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/hug.gif) (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/zwinker.gif)
Great minds indeed!
by the way, food for thought, as someone just reminded me - the election tally in Florida is mysteriously off from the exit polling, as happened with parts of Ohio. added to the fact that the exec from Diebold had promised to "deliver Ohio" and one could start to think something might be awry... :o :-X
With this Administration\'s brother in power in Florida? After the media reported possible problems with the voting machines in Dade County Florida months before the election?
With the exit poll\'s in Ohio and Florida proclaiming Kerry the strongest lead?
Nahhhhh not this upstanding, crooked as a humpbacked snake, administration. Noooooo waaayyyy dude!
*Beats self with tootsie roll* (http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/EMOTICONS/lmao.gif)
*wipes tears* I gotta laugh, because it beats the crying jag I had during the Kerry concession speech. Goddess Bless Edwards, in that he basically said they may be conceding, but their still going to fight for every vote. Bravo bebe, bravo indeed!
And of course there\'s always this latest news bit: http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/04/11/con04482.html
In a perfect world I\'d wake up tomorrow morning and learn that the corrupt Bush Administration and their cohorts who stole this election, were found out and ousted. To be followed shortly by prosecution and potential for imprisonment.
Yep, I\'m a dreamer!
Quotethank you, oldfolkie. i for one appreciate the position this puts the world community in. funny you should say mourning, that\'s what i put on my home page...
unfortunately, your government has already made a pact not to accept our people looking to avoid the draft. if they are going to make that move they need to do it before the draft is called and find a "legitimate" way to stay, or they will be returned to Uncle Sam.
sadly, it\'s not just politics, it\'s money - and that is a deadly combination for humanity.
Shouldn\'t be too surprised about the "mourning" congruity -- pretty obvious that we share certain opinions!
While I know our politicians are mostly spineless &/or well-paid-for, I still believe there will be a way. Or of course there are other countries, just that we\'re kind of conveniently located. It\'s sad that I believe it will be necessary, but all the signs point that way. I just hope people with teenagers figure it out before the fact rather than after. If they can or want to leave. Not everyone can or will, of course. But do you just sit there and watch your children sacrificed? I may sound paranoid, but just because you\'re paranoid doesn\'t mean there\'s nobody out to get you. And we over-50s have seen it all before, in spades. Machete\'s post notwithstanding, all it takes for me to worry about something is for some politician to start denying it! They don\'t bother to deny stuff they aren\'t planning to do...
Side note, we have relatives with children living in the USA, and it\'s definitely a worry. Does anyone here find the term "resident
alien" chilling? Or funny I suppose (thinks of Coneheads...)
Money...well, greed is the root of all evil. Human nature ain\'t pretty, sometimes.
thank you oldfolkie, for reminding me that paranoia can be healthy. in fact, it can be all that stands between one and ignorant bliss, and that can get one killed pretty damn fast.
i\'ve been touting the book Blood and Oil by Michael Krane and i\'m gonna do it again. anyone who doubts that this war is going to go on for a very long time, and spawn others, needs to read that book. he lays it out well and clearly. i\'m going to write in to Charlie Rose and Bill Maher, suggesting that they have Mr. Krane on their shows in panel with others, including someone like Mr. Mortensen, who i understand has a government degree, but lives outside the political industry and has broad international experience.
the only safety mechanism left to the American people is to expose as much of the administration\'s game plan as we can, as early and often as we can, so that pressure can be brought to bear in whatever ways possible by the people. Bush plans to govern with only half the nation\'s "values" in mind, and with only the interests of the chosen few gaining ground. that was not the intent on which this country was founded.
O my. in the weird way that somethings, horrible that they are, have a silver lining. John Edwards would not have been able to focus on the country nor his wife the way he needed to if he were to be VP. She was diagnosed with breast cancer right after the concession speech. He leaves his senate seat in January and will be able to give full time and attention to the center of his universe.
my thoughts about politics and the state of the nation still reel with the loss of the election, but i am certain it was a small blessing for the Edwards family.
I agree that while it is a sad day for America that GW was re~selected into office, this tragedy would have made for quite a challenge to John Edwards, had he won the VP seat. Torn between family and the love of his life, and his career as co~leader of America.
(http://www.imgmag.com/images/lyoness/MessagexGifs/moon.gif) Bless her soul and may the powers lend strength and comfort to Elizabeth and the Edwards family as they fight this together.
Boston Herald Article (*Link*) : http://news.bostonherald.com/election/view.bg?articleid=52560
QuoteDear Machete, [glb]"When you resort to attacking the messenger and not the message, you have lost the debate." Addison Whithecomb[/glb]
Hi Ocean, how\'re you.
If you go back a page and read, I didn\'t attack the message or the messenger. She brought up the draft, and I quoted her so that you knew what I was talking about. I never said "HEY GKG!!..."
It seems that I\'m the only pro-Bush person here, but that\'s ok, I chose not to jump on the "I hate Bush" bandwagon... and I\'m not gonna argue yours or any other persons opinion. I\'m not gonna have you guys hate me over something as simple and stupid as politics. It\'s all about the music here.
hi Machete - you\'ve blasted what i say about the draft before, i don\'t take it personally. i called you a bully, which may not seem fair, but shouting "shut up" sort of cries out for that title. nothing personal.
i do know you like Bush, so i wasn\'t surprised to hear your take - it was nice to see you back on the boards though, you\'ve been quiet so long.
i can\'t agree on your preception of politics being simple, let alone stupid, but it is true that neither of us is gonna persuade the other at this point - and the music is a good common ground.
welcome back - hang around and share some music with us!
:\'(
Quotehi Machete - you\'ve blasted what i say about the draft before, i don\'t take it personally. i called you a bully, which may not seem fair, but shouting "shut up" sort of cries out for that title. nothing personal.
i do know you like Bush, so i wasn\'t surprised to hear your take - it was nice to see you back on the boards though, you\'ve been quiet so long.
i can\'t agree on your preception of politics being simple, let alone stupid, but it is true that neither of us is gonna persuade the other at this point - and the music is a good common ground.
welcome back - hang around and share some music with us!
Like I said, the "shut up" was not directed at you. It was directed at people who keep saying they\'re gonna get drafted, and that the draft is going to be reinstated.
but sweetie, that IS me.
you and i\'ve covered this territory before and it\'s no big to me, i\'m just glad to see ya baaaaack!