keep that tar brush away, you lying snake...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060829/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/rumsfeld_23
Rumsfeld is using that age old ploy: if you don\'t want people to notice that you\'re a dangerous lunatic - accuse someone else of being a raving madman.
It really goes to show how simple their mentality. They see everything in black and white. They don't seem to be able to give Americans credit for having brains and the ability to think for themselves. Our government is the two headed beast with an American flag drawn over their head saying, 'you can't see me. I'm invincible...I mean invisible.' I can see all the monsters in the closet.
the hardest part is holding on to the true ideals - i just hope enough of that can survive the onslaught of slash-n-burn revisionist politics our country is under right now, and that\'s just the tip of the iceberg.
right this minute: the toll in Iraqi lives is unthinkable; the toll relative stability in the region is unconscionable; the true level of long term damage to the world at large is unfathomable.
the level of sheer magnitude of the pissing contest the current administration is in will take generations to assess and address.
some good commentary on same...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12131617/#060830b
Keith delivers incredibly well on this issue. (http://movies.crooksandliars.com/OlbermannBlastsRumsfeldOnFacism.wmv) IMWO this is worth downloading for those long days ahead when state run propoganda TV become too boring to stand.
Some more food for thought:
http://www.e.bell.ca/filmfest/2006/films_schedules/films_description.asp?pageID=&id=88 D.O.A.P.
The Toronto International Film Festival has seen fit to issue this cautionary note to accompany the listing:
Regarding the film D.O.A.P (DEATH OF A PRESIDENT) by UK filmmaker Gabriel Range:
D.O.A.P was chosen to screen as a world premiere at the Toronto International Film Festival in the Festival\'s Visions programme. Visions spotlights films which challenge our notions of mainstream cinema and explore new cinematic territory. D.O.A.P by Gabriel Range is fictional drama told in the style of a documentary. Range, in concert with some of the finest special effects professionals, mixes archival footage with narrative elements to construct a highly original film; a falsified history on what would be a tragic event. D.O.A.P addresses a wide array of contemporary issues including the loss of civil liberties, the ramifications of war, and ultimately critiques the overwhelming influence and manipulation of mass media. For more information on the film, please see the Festival programme note, available online or in the Festival Programme Book.
The Toronto International Film Festival is committed to the free expression of ideas and to engaging audiences in thoughtful discussion about issues of the day. D.O.A.P contributes meaningfully to the public discourse surrounding current social issues, demonstrates highly original storytelling techniques and utilizes innovative digital effects. The film is not exploitative in any way and treats what would certainly be a great tragedy respectfully and un-cynically. In the tradition of great cautionary tales, a terrible and horrifying event unveils certain aspects of society\'s current fears and future trends. The perspectives and / or opinions expressed in films presented at the Festival are those of the filmmakers and do not necessarily reflect those of the Toronto International Film Festival Group.
I\'m attending TIFF again this year, but don\'t know if I\'ll have a chance to get to a showing of this one. Somehow I can\'t see it being a big hit in the States...although perhaps it should be?
QuoteSomehow I can\'t see it being a big hit in the States...
Please reference comment above in regards to said query.
QuoteSomehow I can\'t see it being a big hit in the States...although perhaps it should be?
You are truly one disgusting human being.
Quote
You are truly one disgusting human being.
why? because oldfolkie thinks that people in the US could stand to learn something from viewing it?
Quote
why? because oldfolkie thinks that people in the US could stand to learn something from viewing it?
you\'re even more disgusting than he.
Quoteyou\'re even more disgusting than he.
and still in all you don\'t bother to answer the question put politely forward... why do you say such a thing? there are things to be learned by all sorts of books and movies, whether or not one agrees with the premise put forward. what is your blanket statement achieving? what is your goal or purpose in declaring people disgusting?
be we disgusting in your view or not, i find you sad.
Phartacus, how do you know whether the message of the movie doesn't out way the means? It might be a pro Bush piece...but somehow I suspect not. Look at all the stories, books, movies, done on the premises of what if someone had assassinated Hitler. Are they all sick and disgusting too, or are you just against conjecturing about people you agree with? Welcome to the butterfly effect...what would happen if, and would the outcome be better or worse?
Quote
and still in all you don\'t bother to answer the question put politely forward...
Nothing about you is polite. You spew forth nothing but seething rage, hatred, and bilge.
QuotePhartacus, how do you know whether the message of the movie doesn't out way the means? It might be a pro Bush piece...but somehow I suspect not. Look at all the stories, books, movies, done on the premises of what if someone had assassinated Hitler. Are they all sick and disgusting too, or are you just against conjecturing about people you agree with? Welcome to the butterfly effect...what would happen if, and would the outcome be better or worse?
I know its hard for you malcontents to understand this....but i love america, and im proud to be american. What do i care if someone writes a "what if" about Hitler some 50+ years after he is dead. But to make a snuff fantasy piece about assassinating an ELECTED, sitting president of the country I hold in the highest esteem goes far beyond the pale and whether it be democrat, republican or whatever political pursuasion matters none to me.
Nice try on the whole Bush/Hitler comparison too. I know you kooks love to compare Bush to Hitler. But what was Hitler? He was a Nazi and Nazi\'s were soliciasts (in addition to fascists). And whats a socialist? A socialist is one step below a Communist and one step above a Liberal. So you far left kooks have more in common with Hitler and the Nazis than GW Bush.
But Specifically about this sick, perverted movie...while it offends me greatly (and im not easily offended) I dont really much care about it as im sure it will tank. But for someone to suggest it SHOULD be popular amongst the american people just cause he has nothing but hatred for the President is just disgusting and i can say with all the confidence in the world most sane people will agree with me.
I wasn't trying to compare Hitler to Bush, only the premise, thank you... And actually, even though I may or may not agree with the movies views (I don't know I haven't watched it) I do agree that perhaps the film makers, given this volatile environment, should have been more sensitive. I feel no matter what your regard for the man sitting in the seat you should always hold the office in high esteem. However, I fervently believe that they have the right to tell their story; just as much as we have the right to judge it.
Like many films before it I suspect that this one is getting much more buzz simply because of its controversy and not because it has anything earth shattering to say.
"it\'s definitely a film worth checking out when it comes to your video store, but DOAP is no more of a "must-see" than any other enjoyable, but ultimately forgettable, piece of fiction." a review by some guy on IMDB
I understand more then I think you realize your passion for America and the seated President. But don't assume that I don't have the same passion and love for a country I feel is headed into greed and I pray not to self implosion. I respect your views. I just don't agree with them, but I would never ridicule you or denigrate you for having them. Apparently that is not a trait we share.
QuoteNothing about you is polite. You spew forth nothing but seething rage, hatred, and bilge.
your statement is highly inaccurate and appears rather autobiographical.
bravo for your remarks, buswolley.
gee, I\'m a target... ;)
Just back from TIFF, where I didn\'t see D.O.A.P., but did get a big charge out of the Michael Moore interview with clips from his new projects, cheered on the Dixie Chicks documentary "Shut Up & Sing" and was staggered along with the rest of the viewers at Spike Lee\'s "When the Levees Broke". All excellent productions, and I am SO going to see Moore\'s next 2 films, both "Sicko" which is due out next summer and the one about the 2004 Slacker Uprising.
Strangely, everyone in the U.S. of A. appears to "love America", but the 3 aforementioned seem bent on actually doing something positive about things that aren\'t going so well for it. Sounds like a plan.
Other films we saw (my opinions):
Journals of Knud Rasmussen (beautiful, very dark theme)
Borat Cultural Learnings of America... (somewhat amusing)
A Good Year (entertaining)
For Your Consideration (very funny: watch out, Oscar, you\'re being stalked ;) )
Copying Beethoven (wonderful music, great characters, thin storyline)
Alatriste (Viggo Mortensen in Spanish, SEE THIS!!! 8) )
Snow Cake (my personal favourite of the week)
I believe Alatriste will be released late this year in the States. Try to read some of Perez-Reverte\'s novels in this series before you see it, because it will probably help. It improves on additional viewing (I attended both screenings & got much more the second time). Setting is 17thC Spain, an empire in decay. Afterwards, see if you feel like drawing any parallels. The director & cast didn\'t do any of that, but it certainly suggested some to me.
phartacus, I think you may have taken D.O.A.P. in a way I did not. It is merely a "what if" type movie, I think. Not a "go do this, here\'s how" type of movie.
I\'m also proud to be an American and I love the U.S.A. I just feel that the current administration is not doing our country any favors right now.
And it makes me really angry that my big brother can\'t get treatment at the VA hospitals in his area because they are so underfunded and overwhelmed by the troops returning from Iraq, etc. I\'m comfortable with my position simply because now my brother, who served in the NAVY, a real flag waving type guy, feels the same way. Our troops are being injured and then they come home and the military tries to abandon them. That\'s not right, our President knows it occurs, and nothing is done. I was taught "you take care of your own" and our country isn\'t.
Quotegee, I\'m a target... ;)/quote]
no you\'re an ineffectual complainer, with no logical thought process whatsoever. and still a disgusting human being.
Quotephartacus, I think you may have taken D.O.A.P. in a way I did not. It is merely a "what if" type movie, I think. Not a "go do this, here\'s how" type of movie.
ya know i keep saying you people are disgusting human beings but i think im being a little too nice, cause i really question your humanity.
You know, I don\'t care what a persons views are on this forum, but I do care about the quality of their arguments. Yours have hit rock bottom. Calling people names serves no purpose and does nothing to persuade anyone to your point of view. So your participation is pointless. Is the best you can do to call people disgusting or inhuman, demonstrate otherwise or your done here.
QuoteYou know, I don\'t care what a persons views are on this forum, but I do care about the quality of their arguments. Yours have hit rock bottom. Calling people names serves no purpose and does nothing to persuade anyone to your point of view. So your participation is pointless. Is the best you can do to call people disgusting or inhuman, demonstrate otherwise or your done here.
Sure calling people disgusting human beings could be considered callous but I honestly dont know how else to describe a thought process that thinks it is ok for 44 million innocent children to be murdered in the womb. Combine that with the breathless anticipation of a film that glorifies the murder of a man who was elected by millions of people clearly indicates to me that some of the posters on your board celebrate this "cult of death". If you can come up with a better term to describe this then I\'d love to hear it.
Now being such a huge fan of yours I find it very unfotunate that you would threaten to ban me when the poster "DragonSon" (in a post found here http://www.tdrsmusic.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=politics;action=display;num=1139524600 ) can take a broad brush and paint every american as being greedy, complicit in creating bird flu, and in a round about way question the humanity George W. Bush with no condemnation or rubuke from you.
Maybe you didn\'t notice but I banned Dragonson long ago. It\'s precisely because you can\'t come up with a better "name" as you call it, or argument to buttress your views than to call people names, not your views that I have a problem here. Good god man, you know that. I was alright with you up till your last few posts. You want to mix it up with the people who post here, I got no problem with that, but I won\'t pay for the bandwidth to have people toss crap back and forth. Not being able to fathom peoples thought process is a two way affair. It seems your not here to post your views and discuss the merits of them, your just mad at the other posters for theirs. The internet is full of forums with miles of posts back and forth with worthless name calling crap , I don\'t want this to be one of them.
Anyone can discuss anything here till they start name calling. I told Dragonson to stop name calling and that I respected his intelligence enough to know the difference between discussion and name calling. When he demonstrated he didn\'t, I banned him.
QuoteCalling people names serves no purpose and does nothing to persuade anyone to your point of view. So your participation is pointless. Is the best you can do to call people disgusting or inhuman, demonstrate otherwise or your done here.
Aww, that would be a shame. It is almost refreshing to see someone with whom you can\'t meet eyes come to the edge of loosing their faculties due to the lack of logic in their thoughts. It almost lends credence to the other side of the argument all by itself (regardless what the tact of the discussion is) ;)
Quotewhether it be democrat, republican or whatever political pursuasion matters none to me.
Quote
A socialist is one step below a Communist and one step above a Liberal.
Huh, such contradictory statements in matter of just a few words. Like I said before to you phartacus, you really need to think out things before you spew.
Here are the last five generic ballot polls of registered voters:
USA Today / Gallup (9/17): 51% D--42% R
AP-Ipsos (9/13): 51% D--39% R
Pew (9/10): 50% D--39% R
ABC (9/7): 50% D--42% R
Gallup (9/7): 53% D--41% R
The five-poll registered voter average from these polls is 51.0% D, 40.6% R, with very little variation among the five polls.
So lets see how this all works out. 51% of the US population is Democratic in their political beliefs and in your mind this equals liberal and liberal is what again? Oh yes, WORSE THAN A NAZI! And what exactly is a country other than a group of people under a common political banner (our flag). So, yep. I guess I can see just how much you love this country.
Dirtface? Just wanted to let you know that you\'re way smarter than I am. I couldn\'t make heads or tails of the polls. LOL! Thanks for explaining what it worked out to.
Stuffy,
I suspect I am simply playing to your sarcasm but anyway, I am thinking that all these polls say is that people like pharty love our country because of the democratic tendencies of the majority of its inhabitants. We love our freedom and want to keep it. Some of us simply have difficulties drawing the line from the points A to B. I would submit (hopefully not under coercion) that the concept of maintenance of freedom as predicated on its reduction is fundamentally flawed (duh).
What do you people think? Does pharty have the right idea when he says he loves America? I think yes. I think he is merely in need of guidance to aid him in understanding why he feels the way he does.
Oh, and BTW?! Don\'t you think smart is a silly thing to call a person? I have been lucky enough to have known a few very wise people and maybe they have imparted a small bit of their knowledge on me. Does this make me smart? Nope.
Not being sarcastic at all! But whether or not you\'re smart, I sure as heck didn\'t know what those polls said! So, really, thanks for making what they said clear! ;D LOL! Or it could be from when I was a kid and was bad at math. Maybe now I see numbers and my brain shuts down? Who knows?
I don\'t know about anyone else but I know that I love America because I can agree or disagree with another person. It\'s my right as a citizen! It\'s not like that in a lot of places. So I feel blessed for where I was born and raised!
QuoteI would submit (hopefully not under coercion) that the concept of maintenance of freedom as predicated on its reduction is fundamentally flawed (duh).
I hold the allusion, or perhaps the illusion, that I do give refuge to at least the bare minimum of gray matter to decipher information however...What?!
Ok, never mind, after reading and re-reading I get it. You must have been typing to fast the first time... Yes, very fundamentally flawed!
And yes I do not doubt by the heated, venomous, and vehement comments of Pharty that he does indeed love his country. But I suspect he will never understand that a country that allows for and sometimes embraces our opposing views is what makes it indeed great. And like you so eloquently stated: when those freedoms are stripped away under the guise of maintenance, we must fear, not the country, but for it.
As for the numbers game, I guess we will find out shortly.
Quote
I hold the allusion, or perhaps the illusion, that I do give refuge to at least the bare minimum of gray matter to decipher information however...What?!
Sorry for being opaque.
Well, then thanks for the compliment Stuffy. I guess I misunderstood your response.
QuoteMaybe you didn\'t notice but I banned Dragonson long ago. It\'s precisely because you can\'t come up with a better "name" as you call it, or argument to buttress your views than to call people names, not your views that I have a problem here. Good god man, you know that. I was alright with you up till your last few posts. You want to mix it up with the people who post here, I got no problem with that, but I won\'t pay for the bandwidth to have people toss crap back and forth. Not being able to fathom peoples thought process is a two way affair. It seems your not here to post your views and discuss the merits of them, your just mad at the other posters for theirs. The internet is full of forums with miles of posts back and forth with worthless name calling crap , I don\'t want this to be one of them.
Anyone can discuss anything here till they start name calling. I told Dragonson to stop name calling and that I respected his intelligence enough to know the difference between discussion and name calling. When he demonstrated he didn\'t, I banned him.
actually travis no i didnt notice as i decided not to subject myself to some of the stuff thats posted here and his post that i pointed to was the main factor i quit reading this board. my apologies to you for not clarifying my positions on why i said certain things, but i honestly feel reasoning with some of the folks here is a futile effort, i shall refrain from "name calling" in the future if i even post at all.
Quote
Huh, such contradictory statements in matter of just a few words. Like I said before to you phartacus, you really need to think out things before you spew.
Here are the last five generic ballot polls of registered voters:
USA Today / Gallup (9/17): 51% D--42% R
AP-Ipsos (9/13): 51% D--39% R
Pew (9/10): 50% D--39% R
ABC (9/7): 50% D--42% R
Gallup (9/7): 53% D--41% R
The five-poll registered voter average from these polls is 51.0% D, 40.6% R, with very little variation among the five polls.
So lets see how this all works out. 51% of the US population is Democratic in their political beliefs and in your mind this equals liberal and liberal is what again? Oh yes, WORSE THAN A NAZI! And what exactly is a country other than a group of people under a common political banner (our flag). So, yep. I guess I can see just how much you love this country.
i shall reserve my desire to respond to your biased polls november 8 ;)
But i will say this...I have found it to be a common trait amongst you lefties to twist, spin and just downright misrepresent what your percieved enemies say. Please show me where i said liberals were worse than nazi\'s? You cant cause i never said it. The point i was making was that sandwiched between liberalism and communism is socialism and since the nazis were socialists you libs have far more in comon with nazis than me the prez or any other conservative. We clear on this? Ive also noticed another common trait is to project your own feelings, shortcomings, and hatred for your country on others as well. So when you come here and make what im sure you think is some brilliant post about how little i care for america your just telling me your true feelings. When gkg says she finds me sad I know that its really self loathing she feels. I could go on forever with examples but I wont cause its pointless.
Quote
Aww, that would be a shame. It is almost refreshing to see someone with whom you can\'t meet eyes come to the edge of loosing their faculties due to the lack of logic in their thoughts. It almost lends credence to the other side of the argument all by itself (regardless what the tact of the discussion is) ;)
werent you the guy who just had to run to his computer and complain about hearing Ann Coulter for a split second? And its spelled LOSING and you have long ago LOST it.
Opps! Thanks for pointing out my typo.
Quotei shall reserve my desire to respond to your biased polls november 8 ;)
I am sure you are aware that polls don\'t equal votes. There is the margin of error to contend with and there is always the issue of voter motivation that factors in heavily. Others might point out all the recent disparity in results when using unchecked electronic voting machines but I will leave that one sit (think you can?).
Oh, BTW, you should always capitalize the pronoun \'I\' in case you forgot.
QuoteBut i will say this...I have found it to be a common trait amongst you lefties to twist, spin and just downright misrepresent what your percieved enemies say.
Do you mean something like stating polls are biased because they turn different results then you wish?
Oh, BTW perceived is not spelled with an "ie" but instead with an "ei".
QuotePlease show me where i said liberals were worse than nazi\'s?
OK. These were
your words
"Nazi\'s were soliciasts (in addition to fascists). And whats a socialist? A socialist is one step below a Communist and one step above a Liberal."
I believe the intent of the operatives
above and
below are to stress inferiority or superiority. Do you wish to deny this?
Oh, BTW "nazi\'s" doesn't need an apostrophe in the context it was used and also it should be capitalized. Oh and also "soliciasts" is actually spelled socialists but I see you got it right the second time, kind of... I mean "whats" is a contraction so it could use an apostrophe also. Seems like a trend here, doesn't it?
Quoteand since the nazis were socialists you libs have far more in comon with nazis than me the prez or any other conservative. We clear on this?
I suspect even you have determined that when people make this comparison they are drawing a parallel between the aggressive behaviors of the characters involved and not the exact political ideology. So yes I am very clear on this but you seem a bit fuzzy on reality. Besides, maybe I missed something but I did\'t see anywhere else in this thread a mention along these lines. Oh well, don\'t bother yourself to attempt a cohesive line of thought.
Oh, BTW your logic abilities seems only surpassed by your typing skills. There are too many errors to point out!
QuoteIve also noticed another common trait is to project your own feelings, shortcomings, and hatred for your country on others as well.
Let me get this straight. I say "I love America" and you hear what?
Oh BTW I\'ve has an apostrophe in it (ok, couldn't pass that one up).
QuoteSo when you come here and make what im sure you think is some brilliant post about how little i care for america your just telling me your true feelings. When gkg says she finds me sad I know that its really self loathing she feels.
Now that is rich. Hey, wait you seem to have a serious issue with personal pronouns! What do you suppose that says about you? Psychoanalyze that!
Oh, BTW don\'t forget the board is suppose to be fun. Please explain to me what it is about being a troll that you find \'fun\'?
Thank you, dirtface. You just gave me a good chuckle on an otherwise gloomy day.
A wise person once said: "Don\'t feed the trolls." ;)
Well said! And I agree with Oldfolkie, thank you so much for the smile at the end of a long hot day. As for being 'opaque' you weren't I was just being slow. Sorry if my comment made you think other wise.
buswolley,
I could have said things more plainly. Something like \'How in the heck do you consider reduction of freedom an enhancement?\'. Then again, the obvious answer would of course be, \'Why, it is obviously an enhancement of my powers so I don\'t understand the question\'.
I guess I like to turn a phrase on occasion but maybe I end up twisting it instead....
Cheers.
Quote
... if i even post at all.
and a scant 13 minutes later... he starts rolling again. ya gotta love the irony.